Where are the peers? (plus memory consumption problems)

[lyckos]

Hello

I am using Bitcomet 1.15

I a have a 8 Mbit ADSL internet connection connecting wirelles to my router....

Windows XP SP2, AVG Antivirus 8.0, Spybot Resident Shield, Windows Firewall (Bitcomet exception added)

As you can see in the picture attached, in the Seed/Peer column all of my torrents have 0/0 status even those that are active and downloading such as Michael Jackson Videography that says at download 5kb/s. Also I cannot understand why at the same column everything is [0/***]. This is supposed to be the theoritical peers and the last torrent (Law and order.uk) has had 157 peers and 255 seeders. What is wrong???

My sister who leaves in a different place at the same time and for the same torrent has [3/123]

Another problem is that Bitcomet eats a vast amount of memmory that is gradually getting larger. When I oppen it it starts with 41 MBs and after 15 minutes takes 190 MBs and raising by the second (the numbers were taken by Windows Task Manager) is that normal???

[greywizard]

The first two numbers in that column represent the number of connected seeds/peers; the numbers in square parenthesis show the total number of detected seeds/peers for that particular torrent (the whole swarm).

The only problem I can see here is that you are not connected to any of the available peers for any of your torrents. You should check the Peers tab to see what happens.

What are your connection's tested parameters (upload and download)?

What are your general upload settings of BitComet?

As for your memory readings, they don't seem particularly high for the number of torrents you run simultaneously since many of them have several GBs.

What are your cache settings of BitComet?

[kluelos]

Consider what the numbers mean. Wiz explained them to you, so now look at them and think about them.

Number of seeds you're connected to. Ok. Well, that's the problem, innit?

Number of seeds in the swarm -- how many are out there, connected to you or not. Look at that number. Look at it for each torrent.

It's zero. For every task in your list. nn/nnn[0/nnn] No seeders to be had at all.

People do, for whatever reason, upload torrent files and then not seed them or partially seed them and then stop. Maybe they discovered an error, remade the torrent, re-upped it and are seeding THAT one. Maybe they can't seed for some reasion. Maybe they don't know they need to. Maybe life happened to them, their system broke, they got married/busted/divorced/called up. Anyway, it happens. It seems to have happened to every single torrent you list -- no seeders in the swarm.

(Let me put that another way -- all of the other torrents this DIDN'T happen to have completed & dropped off the task list, so what you're left with is the collection of those that didn't complete.)

In some cases there are a lot of leechers, but they are all in exactly the same position you are in -- waiting for someone to share any piece they don't have, but nobody has any such. Everyone in the swarm has contacted everyone else, everyone's at parity, has all the same pieces that anyone else has. Unless and until someone who has more joins the swarm, none of these torrents are likely to advance, much less complete.

Should you give up on all of them? Depends on how likely you think it is that a seeder may reappear. You or somebody might post a message asking for a re-seed and that might work. Some of them might be temporary interruptions, or seeders who just haven't started seeding yet. (I usually start seeding before I even upload the torrent to the index site, to prevent this very thing.)

Note the progress of each torrent. I usually give it a day (24 hrs). If it hasn't gotten off zero by then, I give up. If the torrent's well advanced and is something unique, I may give it 48 hours, but if there's still no progress, it's time to give up on it as unlikely to ever get any further. It doesn't hurt anything to leave it (not) running, but realistically? Dump it.

[lyckos]

I am sorry for the delayed answer.

That's what i meana bout the total number of detected seeds/peers. Most of those torrents

have total numbers completely different that those on my picture, For example, the torrent:

Numb3rs - Season 1 as you can see on the openbitorrent has 61 seeds and 61 peers, but in

the bitcomet2 pic (my bitcomet) has only 2 total seeds, although there are 2 open truckers for

it. Why?

In speedtest.net my numbers are: Download:6,95 - Upload: 0,32.

Global Max download rate: 800

Global Max Upload Rate: 32

Nat\Firewall and UPnP enabled

Minimum Disk cache....:6

Maximum Disk.............:50

Shrink Disk..................:50

Cache Size....................:512

Auto choose cache........:Disabled

I discovered that by reducing the amount of downloading torrents at the same time and having only 2 active, they had (as you can see) a little bit better speed than they normally would, but they still didn't connect to many peers or seeders and still the number of total seeds and peers was inexcusable low

I just read the second reply to my post.

My friend, kluelos.

I believe i partially answered your interpratation of my zero (0) total seeders in the cloud.

Let's make it more detailed.

The Torrent Called: Mumbers - Season 1, has as you can see in the "openbittorenttracker.jpg" 61 seeders and 61 leechers in the cloud. EVEN if that is just theoritically then that one will convince you: you can see at the "Alternate User" picture that my sister at a different pc, but AT THE SAME TIME WITH THE SAME TORRENT has: 52 seeds ! ! ! and imagine that her port is blocked and mine isn't!

So it is DEFINITELY NOT a problem of leechers here dear friend.

[Anarki]

kluelos, he cannot connect to the peers thats why bitcomet show 0 seeds.

trackers report peers only. bitcomet discover who is a seed and not.

this obvioulsy isnt happening here.

lyckos:

check your max half open connections, set them very low and see if problem went away. also try *STOP* all torrents except the best seeded of them, to see if it starts.

check if your router has problems dealing with many connections

shut down other p2p (and everything else that makes connections at the same time as bitcomet) just for a test.

google your isp to make sure they arent blocking connections or something (or call them)

try another client if nothing else works. install utorrent for example and follow their connection wizard. put apropriate values in it (look up *exactly* what kind of connection you have) and thentry the exact torrent there and see if it starts.

bottom line: something is preventing bitcomet from connecting with other peers. it can also be a firewall issue (it blocks bitcomet completely) or a virus issue that prevnts connections. so look into that as well, but from personal experience, some bad router in the way stalls from the amount of connections.

and judging by your name, i take it you are from sweden right? I am, so if it is the case, what ISP you got?

Edited January 20, 2010 by Anarki (see edit history)

[lyckos]

Anarki

My max half open connection were by default set at 0(-auto). I tried to set them to 1 but the download stopped completely.

I set it back at 0 at it started downloading again.

At many greek forum i read that there is a possibility my ISP is blocking some TCP ports, but my sister (Alternate User Picture) is using the same ISP and she definitely hasn't made any changings regarding the bitcomet settings. I surely must comunicate to my ISP and ask them about that.

I was using utorrent for a long time before i changed it to bitcomet for the same reason (slow download and no seeds).

The phenomenon of no seeds remains wether i download something else or I have everything closed except Bitvcomet.

I mentioned at my first post that i use windows firewall where there is an exception for Bitcomet.

If you could take a look at the last 2 pictures

At the trackers picture you can see that there are two trackers: Thepiratebay & openbittorrent. The first seems that cannot connect to it and there is an error message saying that a connection that was created was cancelled by he software of my main computer.But Openbittorrent seems to work just fine, using the port 80 as you can see. Does that mean that the port works just fine?

At the summary picture you can see that there is 1 seeder and i am connected to him (it's not happening all the time though).

Te conclusion is that I get descent download speeds from time to time but the numbers inside the square parenthesis, it can't be that there are 1003 peers and only 1 seed, thats ubnormal, and i am repeating take a look at the Alternate User pic to see that it's not a dead torrent. Why can't I see any seeds while at the same time my sister sees them?

[lyckos]

My wife connected to my router with her laptop and she has absolutely no problem connecting to seeds and peers !!!!!

I am starting to loose my nerves here!!!

It seems the problem is right in my pc.....

any sugestions?

[kluelos]

@Anarki, I don't know where you're getting your information, but you probably don't want to rely on that source anymore. In an exclusively tracker-based system like the original bittorrent design and like private trackers now, you get all of the peers, seeds and leechers both, only from the tracker. Indeed, that's the tracker's purpose, to keep and distribute a metafile containing a list of interested peers. Whoever told you it only includes leechers, does not know what they're talking about.

The bittorrent protocol is entirely open, and upon applying yourself a little, you can learn all about it for yourself. Just make the effort. Start with the programmers link at bittorrent.org

In addition to the tracker we have DHT, PEX and the magnet-link system, which also add peers -- all peers, seeders and leechers. The PEX system, alone of these, does require contact with other swarm peers, just as you'd think. It's Peer EXchange, so you have to have Peers to EXchange with. This is the only method that does garner any peers from other swarm members, but lacks a way to bootstrap itself, so it can't be the sole method used.

@lyckos, look at your screenshot more carefully.

In general you cannot rely upon an index site's count of the number of seeds and peers or indeed, whether there are any at all. The index site count is always out of date, whether a little bit to a whole lot -- weeks, months or even years out of date. Many of them won't tell you HOW old the count is.

What your client reports, when you get a successful return from the tracker, is the state of the swarm right *now*, which is also the only thing you care about. Who gives a hoot if this torrent was real popular 6 months ago? That's not going to help you at all.

Your screenshot from Mononova is telling you that its count is two months out of date. Now some index sites, including Mononova, offer a facility to update the count right now, but what that does is exactly what your client already did -- contact the tracker and ask for the current list. You should do that, and make a habit of updating the count whenever it's offered. But if it's not offered, and most index sites do not, then you should treat that count as nothing more than an historical curiosity: that's what the swarm count was, a long long time ago in a galaxy far, far away.

Your client contacts the tracker, the DHT network, the other peers it already knows about, gets updates from all of these, and presents you with the situation as it is right now.

[lyckos]

My friend kluelos

I beg you to take a look at whole of my post! I am sure you really want to help me so just read what I say about the "Alternate User" pic. Carefully. VERY VERY IMPORTANT that is.

Don't stick to something that me myself already at my post played down attention on it (theoritical index site count)

Just look at the Alternate User pic and also read my last post before the one you are reading

[Anarki]

kluelos, read what i said again. i said peers not leechers.

not everyone here is a retard you know.

the tracker provides a list of peers to the client, the client then connects to theese peers and establishes them as a seeder/leecher. obviously if his client can not connect to any of the peers then its gonna show theese statistics he is reporting (many theoretical peers, yet none connected, and no seeds). This is a common problem and I have experienced similar problems myself and solved them too.

also for christ sakes listen to the man? the files in question has seeders. period.

lyckos, first of all, the fact that you cannot connect to the piratebay tracker is becouse it isnt working properly all the time theese days. This behavior is normal and does not have to do with the port. Main point is that the other tracker is working.

Also that you arent connected to a seeder all the time is normal bwcouse bittorrent transfers is rotated after a while, meaning one peer (seeder or leecher) drops you and takes on another. so that you cant keep a connection to a seeder isnt anything special. what is however more weird here is the fact that your client seems to have a very hard time connecting to the peers. this can also lead to a disconnect of course. like your client actually establishes a connection but fails to transfer anything from it, and is as such, dropped by the other client.

but we have established that your sister etc can download so we can rule out the ISP in question.

also the router.

so the problem is in your own computer. one fun fact is that when you stop many tasks, the other picks up the pace a little. first thing that comes to my mind is again too many connections being made at the same time becouse this is a common problems with routers. many cant handle a vast amount at the same time and therefore they "hang" the connections, making bitcomet drop them properly.

now to the point, that it seems only your computer have theese issues then i can only think of the following things:

- a virus. becouse some viruses makes many connections at the same time from your PC, and thus, can easily stall your router, and create this exact issue in bitcomet that you are having. have you made a virus scan? reformat your computer maybe?

- another p2p. if you ahve *any* other p2p in the background at the same time, behvaiour is the same as the virus. with the making connections thing i mean.

- network card. bad drivers? I had a onboard network card once, who i (by accident, unknowingly) installed the wrong drivers too. it worked to surf with, but when doing torrents, it stalled completely, creating your exact problem here. a complete reinstall of the drivers (to the correct ones) actually solved this problem.

otherwise, as last resort, it can be some software problem maybe - meaning a problem created by some application on your computer - but that is to wide of a thing to take here. that you have to experiment yourself with. its too much that can be wrong. again, a reformat?

[greywizard]

@Anarki: I'm sorry to burst your bubble my friend but you are wrong. As kluelos told you already, the tracker does return to your client both the number of peers and seeds. Should you have heeded his advice and read the BitTorrent protocol specifications, specifically the Tracker Response section, you would have learned that by yourself.

Furthermore The Pirate Bay tracker is not "not working properly all the time theese days". It doesn't run at all, anymore. Period.

That's since last November. They rely now solely on DHT and PEX for tracking the torrents they index.

This announcement was for a couple of weeks on their homepage, in November, and can still be found in the blog section of the site under the name of Worlds most resiliant tracking.

This is what accounts for the error message in the Trackers tab, since, obviously, this torrent was made before the tracker server was closed.

@lyckos: I'm not going to argue if you have a problem or not. I'm just going to suggest a few things to consider.

In your first two pics, indeed, there is a big difference between the number of seeds returned by your client and your sister's.

I'm going to assume that both pics were taken after a fairly long amount of time, after that specific torrent was started in both of them (because if your torrent had been shortly started, then the whole comparison is irrelevant).

Still, that difference can be accounted by PEX and DHT. If your sister's client connected different DHT nodes and peers than yours, it may have gotten from those, the extra seeds you were lacking by connecting to other peers which didn't know about those seeds yet (the pool of peers was pretty big; over 1000).

Furthermore in your second set of pics, you can see that both your client and your sister's client have the same number of detected peers (about 390) and only one seed. What's more, even if she was connected to that single seed reported and you were not, your downloading speed was greater than hers.

Which thing obviates another fact related to the one I've presented above: that is, peers you connect at any certain point can have very different connection parameters and very often, in a normal healthy torrent, you get most of your downloaded pieces from other peers, not necessarily from seeds.

Sure thing, seeds are more appetizing to a client, since you're less prone to get chocked, because they don't expect anything from you in the "tit-for-tat" scheme.

But as long as you have peers with healthy connections, a decent upload speed per torrent, and the number of aggregate copies inside the swarm is reasonably high, you can finish a download, at very good speeds, without ever connecting to a seed.

Now, I'm not sure for how long has this little experiment of observation has been going, but you may want to carry it on a little longer, using identical torrent as until now, and focusing especially on the average downloading speeds both clients display, instead the number or seeds .

Provided you and your sister have identical Internet connections speeds, if you constantly (that is, in a matter of several hours on several days) get speeds much lower than the other client, then and only then you can really start thinking you have a problem.

Other than that, differences in displayed speeds are to be expected, since BitTorrent swarms are very dynamical network groups and your downloading speed at any given moment, highly depends on the individual peers to which you are connected at that particular time.